I feel the future of our club is indeed moving to a new ground.
So what’s stopping us?
Developers finding a new site not further away from Northwich town centre than the current ground.
I feel this could well be an impossible task. I cannot think of one site that matches this criteria, and if there was one, I doubt very much if it is available for sale, and if it was, whether or not it would affordable by the developers.
I think we should re-consider this condition of the moving to another ground.
I believe the argument on this used to be that we would prefer a ground near the centre of Northwich, so supporters could walk to the ground. This option is no longer affordable.
Once you make the decision that you have to drive to the ground, it doesn’t bother me
if it takes 10 or 15 mins in the car.
As such, I think this condition should be changed. I think we will have a far better chance of finding a new site if we broaden the boundaries by another mile or two.
If, (and I know it is a big if), the developers can raise £1.25M up front, I don’t believe we should dismiss the idea of buying a ready made stadium. There is one for sale in the area and it would not take a lot to re-paint it and change the seat colours to ones of our choice. To build a stadium of that magnitude would cost £3M-£5M in today’s market, so it is not something we should dismiss likely. It should also be very easy to rent out the stadium to another football team, with the income funding 50% of our players budget. If we managed to receive in access of £2M for our land, then that could leave us with 3/4 of £1m in the bank. The interest on that figure would pay for another 25% of our playing budget, which would mean we could well be the only club in the land trading solvently.
We would also have to rename the Danebank to [color=#FF0000][size=4][/size][/color]‘THE BRIAN PRITCHARD ENCLOSURE’
The place you are referring to is a vast empty, wind swept wilderness with 500 on at the moment, what would it be like with half that number there watching a game?
The stadium is quite obviously not commercially viable - it is on its 3rd incarnation now after less than 5 years. How long before any sale money we realised just went into the same bottomless pot.
Would you really want to rely on NVFC for rent money!! Given their history of paying debts!
If we did do that, we may as well look at merging - both clubs support is dwindling and if local clubs are to survive it needs a different approach.
Before WHS and others come on telling of our rise on the back of Vix demise then let me tell you it will never happen. There will always be a Northwich Vics team and however unpalatable it is to some they will always have the support of the town behind them - So their support and our assets merged could be a logical way forward!
My preferred option is to stay put, let the developers do what they want around us, we will benefit financially anyway because of the Robert’s land.
The value of our land and business can only rise as a result of more houses being built and people being within walking distance of the ground and social amenities.
not convinced about that, I would imagine that land is cheaper than it has been for years right now - with internet taking a lot of shop trade and then recession to finish them off I can not see Northwich Town Centre Land being in big demand right now - the real problem is finding a space big enough to house a stadium for sale.
The arguments for buying ready made stadium are obvious and would not really be worse off then now the question is if we wanted to move again in the future closer to the town would we get our money back for the stadium or not - if the answer is yes then it is a no brainer - nothing to lose but if the answer is no then we could end up stuck with it
Can we generate revenue from this stadium? or is long term goal to relocate to where more revenue can be generated?
One thing to consider is that what is now an industrial estate would become a residential area and all of a sudden you could have a ground within a mile and a half of town centre, on all the new bus routes etc, with infrastructure shops, pub etc.
Instead of moving away from a craphole industrial estate to a better area, sell WP, let them create a nice residential area and buy the stadium next door on the cheap, finish building it properly, red out any evidence of green and open the club every night to the new locals (sky sports, sports quiz, strippers, ladies night whatever etc) (quite a number if all the houses are built), build some pitches, gym, squash courts etc. and increase revenue that way. Rent out the stadium to local poorper football clubs - , maybe get lots of lottery money to convert the whole area into a sports village
We have an opportunity right now while we are in strong position and competition is basically all but bankrupt - if we do not sort ourselves out now , then we never will.
Has anyone considered joining with another club, (and I don’t mean Vics,) in a ground share? I am thinking of Lostock Gralam, Barnton or even Middlewich. The money we would have from the sale of our ground would change their grounds dramatically. There may well be other similar options, anyone any ideas? By the way, if Vics do go belly up again, where do you think they will end up? NorthWest Counties? And where would they play,in Rushe’s back garden? No, if they go belly up they will go defunct and they know it. I agree the stadium across the water is far to big to be viable, it is a “Great White Elephant”.
WHS.
We have to get this right, if we move to the town which is very difficult to see because of costs and lack of options then we will need facilities to make money on top of our interest earned on capital-we must not let that capital be eaten up by over ambition and greedy players look at all the teams that have had new grounds and money it always gets blown including us, vics, Nantwich ?, the advantage of moving nearer the town is that in time it might well be sellable as housing again ? will it add numbers to our gate I doubt it really.
If we could aquire a local ground on the cheap which would leave us more capital we have to consider this surely, if we are the 100% holders then we do have the option to make it more atmospheric - small covering at either end would help, enclose the pitch not huge costs - repainting etc, we can then settle on this as a long term base, if we can get rental from another team such as vics or mu reserves then so be it but it would be on our terms, if vics say did not like this then they can go forth and multiply and start again from the bottom and ground share with lostock ! however whichever way it goes then it is adavanatage to us and my ambition is to see Witton as the number one team in the town playing at either conf north or nat conf level not football league.Ground share yes on our terms amalagamate never - I would not support or watch that
I don’t think Chinkers would be big enough WHS, nice idea though. Land on the back of Cromwell Rd, Winnington? Although the land isn’t flat and I’m not sure if anybody actually owns it, it has enough room and not too far from Town.
Fascinating discussion. Not sure what we should do but we have to accept that we are simply existing at the moment. While I appreciate how difficult this has been, and thank those who do the work to make it happen, I think we do need to carefully consider the future.
The idea that Witton can ever get back into the Conference in the next 10 years is fantasy. Even the Conference North is well beyond our means at the moment. A club like ours that struggles to get 200 for a home game cannot compete with the likes of Telford, Fleetwood, Southport etc. We have to come up with a strategy that will allow us to survive and hopefully thrive. I doubt very much that this means buying the white elephant over the canal. Too large and very little scope for making money outside of the gate receipts. If Wittoners want to watch Conference football, which would be nice as I seem to remember enjoying our time in there, then the only option is to merge.
If we want to stay on our own then we have to look at how we can become an integral part of the community. This means having facilities that can be used by community and having other sports clubs using those facilities. Why not Witton hockey team, Witton netball team, Witton Bridge Club playing out the Witton Sports Club?
If we stay as we are then I can see a long, sad further decline and we will be become less relevant to the town as more and more people move into and out of the area who will have no affiliation to the club.
We should explore all possibilities and hopefully there can be a sensible debate on this forum. Football clubs are going bust all over the country because they simply did not adapt and accept the reality of the situations they were in. If we have to share with other clubs or downsize our aspirations to survive then so be it.
The future of the club - that is more important than anything else !
If moving ground ensures our future then it does’nt matter where we play. I would not be against purchasing the stadium over the canal if possible but I think we have too many bigots who would disagree.
Any move would I think have to encompass facilities that we could offer to the people of Northwich and then we may get some backing from the Council ?
We have to remember that our attendances are diminishing and there are very few young supporters attending games.
There is some land off Manchester Road where the old railway sidings were which could be suitable ?
Safeguarding the future of this proud club requires some kind of vision that will allow income to be earned beyond matchdays. 200 or less through the gate each week would probably leave us in our current league or even the North West Counties.
I understand that the original decision to move to Wincham was based on plans to provide more than just a football stadium and would have included floodlight five a side pitches etc. These, to me are key to allowing us to bring in people and hard cash.
The proposed redevelopment of the Wincham area can only be good for the club. Either we become surrounded by housing that brings in people who will be looking for leisure opportunities on their doorstep, and I can’t think of anything like that in the area at present.
Or, the club accepts an offer for the ground to be re-developed and moves to somewhere else and this time does build more than just a stadium.
Look on the positives; we (the club) own our own ground and don’t have the ridiculous debts that have seen other clubs go to the wall both within the Football League and outside it.
For me there is only one real option if we are going to move and that is to buy the Victoria Stadium and rent it back to Vic’s. How else are we going to obtain a Conference Standard ground for 1.2 million we certainly won’t be able to build a ground for that figure.
I can see where people are coming from in terms of the extra overheads but how much extra would they actually be? Ok their ground is bigger but not that much bigger and I am sure that there are ways we can save money i.e. if we are required to have extra stewards the we can close certain parts of the ground etc.
If we managed to obtain around 2.5 for our ground then this would leave enough money to buy the VS, secure the long term financial future of the club and spend a little on the actual football team.
I would have no qualms with sharing a ground with Vic’s it makes financial and football sense and surely would enable us to move forward on a more positive footing rather than stagnating as we are now.
Why would we groundshare with a club that is to all intents and purposes bust? Is the idea of a groundshare with Lostock not viable? For one thing, not long ago there was talk of the pub and the bowling green going for housing, buy that land and the Lostock ground and you have a very viable proposition. I am sure Lostock would be happy to groundshare if it meant their ground was something really special. It maybe that we would have to go for joint ownership of the ground, but any deal with Vics has got to be a NO NO!! I am a Wittoner, I would not watch Witton Victoria or Vale Royal Rangers and nor would a lot of other Wittoners. If that is what is on the cards count me out. There is nothing wrong with being a biggish fish in a small pool, better that than a big fish at the end of a hook like Vics are.
WHS.
I think it’s an interesting point WHS and something that should be explored further. But my only concern with this is how much capital would someone like Lostock be able to put into a joint venture or how much rent would they be able to pay? Also I can imagine that it will take a fair bit of cash to bring their ground upto even Unibond standard and no doubt even more money for Conference North standard.
If we could build a new ground of the same or better standard than Wincham Park for around 1.2 million then great. But what I wouldn’t see the point off is spending 2 million on a new ground just because we don’t want to play on the same pitch as Vic’s. Lets be honest Vic’s will be in the town in one form or another whether either with Jim Rushe or a trust run club so there will always be revenue opportunity from rent. Don’t forget as well we would be the owners and Vic’s the tennants we could rename the ground (Alf Ashley stadium etc), paint it red and white and generally remove all trace of green.
I think if you were looking at this from a simple business perspective without any emotion then buying the VS is the most sensible option. However I think there is a lot that needs to happen before any final decision is taken and I am sure Mark Harris will analyse every option before presenting it to the shareholders.
Taken from a purely business perspective, then i don’t think any course of action that alienates a large portion of your customer-base is ever a wise business move.
That empty cavernous bowl will always be the VS. It doesn’t matter what colour it is painted, or how it is renamed.
BT Cellnet Stadium anyone? No, but i bet you know the Riverside Stadium.
GMB Stadium? No, coz we always called it Wincham Park.
Rebranding Old Trafford to the Coca Cola Stadium wouldn’t stop everybody from knowing it as Old Trafford.
You don’t just change the name of a ground and it stops being what it originally was.
Ground share with Lostock is one I would fancy, Nick they dont need to invest in the asset !they already own it we need to buy into by investing in it, they share the joint ownership and benefit further by improved facility, We however would have the surplus funds to buy the Pub and have that as our base and future fund raiser, is there enough parking ? im not sure we would have to maybe lose the bowling green, the pitch has just been resurfaced and drained ? its on a main road access is simple location is good ? is it possible I dont know but surely worth exploring, but I would not discount the VS just yet that would put us in strong position as well and thats what we need to get out of a ground move for me im happy as being a strong conference north club, the gates at a good local facilty would increase to compete at that level I think.
One other point CJ, there is a bloody great field next to the ground at Lostock, probably farm land, if we got that too we would be home and dry, car parking, plastic pitch, bowls, darts, tennis, what ever you fancy.
WHS.
Just been on Google Earth. There is a massive green area on the opposite side of the road. I seem to remember there was talk of it becoming Lostock Cricket Ground after the old ground went under the concrete of the Lostock Triangle. Who owns it now? is it available? Can someone find out because it could be the answer we are all looking for.
WHS.
