Sorry GE, giving you a lot of work lately 
This is insane. Were we not told a few months ago that we were sitting on a gold mine just waiting for houses to be built? cant we ride it out until then? Why oh why oh why would we even consider having the greens anywhere near Northwich? They are finished and instead of dancing on their grave we are giving them a Lazarus like helping hand to keep going.
Why not merge the 3 teams? is that any more insane?
[quote=“The Albion Tea Hut” post=55664] Why oh why oh why would we even consider having the greens anywhere near Northwich? They are finished and instead of dancing on their grave we are giving them a Lazarus like helping hand to keep going.
Why not merge the 3 teams? is that any more insane?[/quote]
I’d rather have Northwich Victoria playing at Witton Albion than have no Witton Albion at all! Or maybe we’ll just accept sliding down the leagues all because we were too proud to make what is essentially a big BUSINESS decision.
Obviously I can understand people’s strong opinions on the subject, but it appears some would rather watch the Albion burn just to spite Vics!
Well said left pegger and I like the idea of merging all three teams !! Play at Wincham park of course and then what about a name - got it “Witton Albion” that’s got a lovely ring to it Sorted.
They have over a quarter of a million pounds worth of debt and assets of a couple of thousand. Where on earth in any business case of theirs do they afford groundshare with us or anyone. The sums just do not add up and any offer they have made is clearly pie in the sky nonsense. Payment upfront, let’s get real here how can they pay tuppence-ha’penny up front. And for how long upfront as they clearly cannot ever build a new ground, this is not happening surely??
[quote=“The Albion Tea Hut” post=55664]This is insane. Were we not told a few months ago that we were sitting on a gold mine just waiting for houses to be built? cant we ride it out until then? Why oh why oh why would we even consider having the greens anywhere near Northwich? They are finished and instead of dancing on their grave we are giving them a Lazarus like helping hand to keep going.
Why not merge the 3 teams? is that any more insane?[/quote]
Where would you suggest our new home would be if we sold WP given that CWAC have said on numerous occasions that they would not allow a football ground in town?
MM I know it doesn’t add up but as has been pointed out they have been paying rent for a number of years now to Stafford and Flixton so they can somehow run the model, the official club may be carrying debt with little assets - but the match day rent ( and maybe wages ) may be paid from another account either linked to the club or to a sponsoring benefactor.
Left Pegger no Witton at all?? are we in such deep doo doo so soon after my proudest moment as a Wittoner at Curzon Ashton (better than Wem-ber-ley for me because I BELIEVED it was done on a sustainable basis) what on earth is going on here??
Well obviously I don’t mean right now, I was implying that if the club continues to continue on the current trajectory, when who knows where we’ll be in 10/15 years.
I think this would be a far more productive discussion if those so strongly opposed to this idea would post an alternative business plan that would provide simliar funds to a groundshare. The football club is obviously struggling to maintain a competative playing budget and requires more funds otherwise this very emotive subject would not have raised its head again.
Now there’s a statement to ponder …
Q1: Why Stafford?
A: Because nobody closer would touch them with their record and reputation
Q2: Why Flixton?
A: Because it was a moribund ground following the demise of the club that played there and earmarked for development in a couple of years anyway, so they were filling a gap. Match day rent is peanuts, probably even covered by the crowds flooding through the turnstiles.
Q3: Why move?
A: See Q2, but also because they want the publicity coup of a return to Northwich. Fair enough. I can see folk preparing the bunting already, though they’ll have to pass on the open bus tour as they still owe them money
Q4: What do you call a business carrying debt with little assets?
A: A basket case, a shell, a front for something else?
Q5: What other account?
A: Not from the (in all but documented name) owner. He told me personally 2 years ago that he’d already sold all his property to pay bills (though I’m not sure which!). And he’s bankrupt anyway (hence not being on documents)
Q6: What sponsoring benefactor?
A: The $64,000 question. Chris Tarrant maybe has the answer in a sealed envelope but phoning a friend won’t help you. This must be such an altruistic benefactor that they don’t even want the reward of having their name advertised on the shirts as a sponsor - in case you hadn’t noticed, NVFC do not have a single sponsor. Or maybe they have reasons for remaining in the shadows?
Don’t get me wrong - I have no reason to interfere in your club’s business decisions and it’s your choice whether to close your eyes while taking the banknotes. At least they will all be nice and clean, if perhaps a little damp. But I believe you need to go into this arrangement (if it happens) with your eyes wide open. I wish you luck. You may need it.
But I do have reason to pontificate against anything that JR & Co do with the remnants of a once-proud club. Along with Connett they managed to destroy a relatiionship with a home-town club which in my case stretched back nearly 50 years. I did not desert the club when I opted for 1874. The club had already deserted me and the community which supported it - magnificently demonstrated by JR holding up a red card to the fans of “his” club at the game at FCUM. Ponder that when you play them next - how would you react if your Chairman treated you with such disdain? Perhaps I sound bitter. Maybe that’s because I am.
Yes your right a bitter response, I will trust our board to do due diligence and be eyes wide open, however with an open mind Vics paid a decent rent at Stafford and they then spent £10k. Getting the Flixton ground fit upfront, bought a fair àmount of equipment on top and paid the rent plus funded a seemingly strong wage bill albeit on low gates so they can finance the move the funds may be hard to understand how but it is not Wittons job to police this ( again ) I am sure Witton will be aware this may not be a long term deal but for now it’s appears to be the best offer we have. Nvfc may for all we know be looking or have commitment to bring in other business men to support the move we have not been party to all the discussions.
The Witton board is nothing like anything Vics have had for years they are honest and open and above board decent people we are lucky in that respect they will not put the club in jeopardy and I don’t think for one moment Jim Rushe will get a foot in the door and buy into Witton or join our board it will not happen.
Whilst I wont discuss the ins and outs of the club finances on an open forum, if anyone wants to discuss this I will be at the game on Saturday and will gladly answer questions.
Yes but how, how did they pay a decent rent at Stafford, and how did they magic up 10K to refurb Flixton?? 2004 was liquidated, Rushe is a bankrupt again and the club (2007 incarnation now) is terminally in debt again (maybe they have 2015 waiting in the wings for when they’ve ripped off local businesses round there too). Would we not be bitter if some Manchester so-called businessman had lost us our ground and destroyed us, leaving us playing in front of so few at elsewhere?
I’m very pleased to see that this subject matter has kicked off into sensible debate (Unlike the 2012 message ‘bored’) with the majority of Witton fans in favour of Vics returning to Northwich and taking over Wincham Park as our new home.
Fingers crossed that you don’t get relegated at the end of the season because I’m led to believe that if Vics win promotion we’d take priority over home games as the senior club in town and that would be a little embarrassing in our first season and would breach what I think will be a very good relationship.
A couple of things for me really on this subject, one what the hell had it got to do with the 1874(2012 formed) so called football fans? Again I thought they were their own club with their own badge, own kit design, own identity, oh wait… This is an arrangement between Northwich Victoria and Witton Albion!!! And for me I would love to see the LOYAL Vics fans that I know, who have stuck by their team through all the demise and spend their hard earned money, and time on travelling to Stafford week in week out then Flixton to be rewarded with THEIR team being back in Northwich!
One last thing what the hell has it got to so with anyone Witton or 1874(2012 formed) fans where the money comes from? Do I pick up my wages every Friday and moan about where it comes from and I am paid by the Government? (no more corrupt than them!)
So Witton fans like Neil says if you have a problem speak to him on Saturday? And as for 1874(2012 formed) just go back to Winsford this doesn’t concern you!
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I’m not pro-groundshare but pro Witton so obviously if the business is in that much of a financial muddle it needs to raise revenue then every avenue needs to be considered - I would suggest however that shareholders be made aware of any problems.
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The devil is in the detail from the supporter of the club previously known as NVFC ‘when we take over Wincham Park’ mmmmm interesting.
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I understand 1874’s grievances they have lost their club they loved and grew up with and are powerless (even though many of them loved being on unsustainable gravy train of Sunderland and the televised FA Cup run). Lets be honest its there but the grace of god because if our 3 or 4 major shareholders got together then we too would be powerless on the future direction of our football club.
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Wouldn’t it be good if we could get back to talking about football!!!
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Its only a game!!!
UTA WTID VMMP ALOTDFFS
Fair play to Witton for doing this deal. Great business sense. Witton cannot lose, it is as simple as that. Cannot understand what all the fuss is about to be honest. There is only one disillusioned person and his name is Derek. He believes that he will attract a few hundred people to their games. God loves a trier.
Let’s look at the facts,
- We are the only club out of the three who own our own home which puts us in pole position.
- We have had debates on here regarding our budget or lack of it, surely extra cash has got to be a must
- Both the other teams I’m sure would love to be back in Northwich, and they know how good our facilities are and how well our club is run, I take these as compliments.
Taking this into consideration who cares who comes and uses our ground, as long as its on our terms and money is payed up front and on time. We also take the money from the teahut and bar.
We have a wonderful bunch of volunteers who fund raise tirelessly for the club but in the end something’s got to give , and if we can make money elsewhere then so be it.
When we first moved to Windham park we had to go and play a few games down at Drill field, we all went because we are Wittoners and we follow the club,
Personally having played a lot of football over the years it saddens me to see the state of the local leagues not just in Mid Cheshire but all over. The kids of today have to many distractions and simply are not interested in football as much as we were, and it worries me when I stand on the terrace at games and see the same faces growing older that I’ve seen for the 35 years I’ve been watching Witton, we have got to face fact we are struggling to attract new generation fans and the more we deny it the bigger the problem will become.
We need to allow the board to make the best decision for the club and for me there is no alternative but to allow a team to use our ground irrespective of who it is.
[quote=“jonnyamery” post=55681]A couple of things for me really on this subject, one what the hell had it got to do with the 1874(2012 formed) so called football fans? Again I thought they were their own club with their own badge, own kit design, own identity, oh wait… This is an arrangement between Northwich Victoria and Witton Albion!!! And for me I would love to see the LOYAL Vics fans that I know, who have stuck by their team through all the demise and spend their hard earned money, and time on travelling to Stafford week in week out then Flixton to be rewarded with THEIR team being back in Northwich!
One last thing what the hell has it got to so with anyone Witton or 1874(2012 formed) fans where the money comes from? Do I pick up my wages every Friday and moan about where it comes from and I am paid by the Government? (no more corrupt than them!)
So Witton fans like Neil says if you have a problem speak to him on Saturday? And as for 1874(2012 formed) just go back to Winsford this doesn’t concern you![/quote]
If football fans concerned themselves with the moral wranglings of off field politics and finances, football clubs would have no fans. Football is financially and morally corrupt from the top to the bottom and if the FA and/or Government authorities aren’t concerned about resolving this issue from the top to the bottom, then why should fans be bothered who is financing their club.
I will admit that I’ve not been to watch Vic’s on a regular basis since the Marstons Stadium was lost, I traveled to Stafford a few times but lost interest in not having our own ground, I’ve not been to Flixton. I have been to watch a couple of 2012 Northwich FC matches and it does have a feel of the old Drill Field atmosphere, (less the Dane Bank and the big crowds) but the fact remains they aren’t the Vics and never will be the big historical senior non league club in town that Vics are and will always be.
Once the real Northwich Vics return home, albeit Wincham Park, I can see many fans returning from 2012 Northwich FC and from the town, maybe not so much the old and bold who are stuck in their ways and would never step foot in the Swamp but certainly the younger generation and majority that have been disjointed, disillusioned and/or in limbo watching local football at Witton.
A good bit of joint marketing will increase public and business feelings and show a good joint working relationship between Vics and Witton Albion.